What is authentic success? Dissolving societal norms to find your own path.

Fiona: 00:02

We often think of wellbeing as one-dimensional. What if we look at it from a different perspective?

Josephine: 00:08

The possibilities are endless. All we have to do is step outside the square.

Let's walk this walk together and hold on tight for the ride.

Fiona: 00:16

My name is Fiona. I'm a corporate wellness facilitator, body image and eating psychology coach and a lover of joyful experiences.

Josephine: 00:24

And I'm Josephine, a dietitian, somatic release therapist and a recovering people pleaser and perfectionist.

Fiona and Josephine: 00:30

Welcome to Outside the Square.

Fiona: 00:34

Hello, welcome back here we are again

Josephine: 00:42

Hi Fiona.

Fiona: 00:44

So excited. We are talking about authentic success this week. It is a very interesting topic when you talk to people about success.

I think sometimes it's one of those things that make us go, ooh actually, do we have a little bit of fear around success?

I've been asked that question before. Are you afraid of failure or are you afraid of success? And sometimes that success piece can get in the way.

So I'm really excited to dive deep into this conversation about authentic success and how we can feel about it.

Josephine: 01:28

I have flipped what success means to me on an absolute 180 degrees. What I thought success was five years ago to what I think success is now is so remarkably different.

And because I like sometimes I'm like, who is this person? I don't even recognise you Josephine. yeah, who is this new version of me?

And it all comes down to what I define as success.

Fiona: 02:02

Yeah, I love that. And that the way you've just gone, I don't even recognise anymore because yeah, I've changed my own definition of what I actually thought that I wanted or what I was striving for.

Josephine: 02:20

Mmmmm. And that is the deconditioning process, isn't it? We're born into families or groups in society that condition I have to believe is something is success.

So for me, it was a private girls school. The principal would stand up at the beginning of every school year and say how many girls got into law school and how many got into med school and didn't mention any other options, you know, that was my definition of success so of course I went and tried to get into med school and yeah our family was one of those families that you work hard and then you earn success and while that definitely made me studious it also put a lot of pressure on myself that I always had to be working hard to deserve anything good in life. Yeah and that was not something that I there is not something I choose to believe anymore. I have deconditions that to almost completely I'd say that I now know the more fun I have and the more ease I have in my day then I'm going to define that as my success.

Fiona: 03:41

Mmmm. I love that because learning what success is about, as you say, often comes from others. It comes from what we learn about what success is.

And this conversation becomes about defining that for yourself, about what that means to you, not what you've been taught to believe success is all about.

For me, if you'd asked me as a child what I wanted to be when I grew up, I would have said I don't know, I had no clue really, other than saying a mum, I will be a mum.

That was all I, not because I think I wanted it, but because I thought that was what happened, was that you grew up, got married, you had babies, that was just how it was going to be.

And I sit here now having gone through a lot of dark nights of my soul feeling like a failure for not having achieved that goal of getting married or having a child.

And yet when I think about that now on the other side of that, I will turn 40 this year and I am living a single life on my own and I love it.

And I have fully and utterly embraced my role as being an auntie to pets and children alike. I love that.

I love the idea of being part of that community for the children who are in my life. And I have come to that sense of that is success for me now.

Now that's not to say that those things might not still come for me at some point in my life, but it is about having that definition, I always thought that's what success in life meant for me.

For me as a woman, for me as a member of a big family, so everyone has multiple children, there's lots of cousins, there's lots of aunts and uncles, and so I felt like the odd one out.

And everyone would say you'll be a really good mum one day, you'll be a really good wife one day, and so I felt like a failure when I didn't achieve those things.

But that success was not about me, that was. I thought I was failing them because they thought I'd be good at it.

So when you're really able to go through that dark night of the soul, you said Josephine in your experience as well, coming to unlearn or you know be able to redefine what that success means, either in those big areas, like I've just talked about or as you say, in those small moments day to day, it's deconditioning yourself to what you've learnt and refining that in terms of what that means to you.

Josephine: 07:11

Yeah, it's big isn't it? It starts in the little moments. Like, the one time I feel huge success in my body, like that feeling of, it's almost similar to relief for me, it's like, pace, calm, proud on top of things is when I stop working before I get tired like I close the laptop and go and have morning tea on the days where I could have kept going but it was becoming less fun and I was becoming less effective and that's part of that redefining the expectation that I had with myself growing up was that I worked long hours to achieve success.

My father had that, my mother had that, their parents had that but it is like your story Fiona asking yourself well whose expectation is this?

If I’m feeling pressure to do something which I think I'm failing at? This is actually even my expectation to start it.

Is it my expectation that I have babies and get married right now? And often its not, yeah you know the expectations you want to hold yourself to but we just are conditioned to hold other expectations that we grow up with.

Fiona: 08:38

And in your example that Josephine where you say, what success feels like in my body and that's really key because it's about you understanding and feeling those moments of success and being able to replicate that.

So I think when you sort of say, you know, I'm able to close that laptop down, I'm able to stop.

I could push through, but actually it feels successful to me to be able to stop. I feel calmer. I feel more able to, you know, take that break.

And if you think about the expectation that sits underneath that, which is for you that you work hard, you actually probably being more efficient when you come back after that break than if you push through. So it's also defining what does working hard mean?

Does working hard mean pushing through for the full, you know, eight hours or five hours or however many hours you've decided you're going to sit in front of a camera or the computer I should say?

Or is working hard, working efficiently in those smaller areas and understanding when it is that you need to take a break because you can feel it in your body.

So I think that feeling piece around what to success feel like is a really important driver for us to be able to find it.

Josephine: 10:14

Yeah, absolutely, because sometimes what you feel successful is Like even last night my son Monty got all the little paper cups out to make cupcakes and my mum would have done that for me, she would have jumped into making the muffins and done it for me, and then a good mum in the process, but I was really tired, and I said no, and I got that ripple of success through my body of, oh, everything feels relaxed.

I can feel my aura expanding, I can feel my energy expanding, I can feel myself, I can feel calm and content in that decision, even though he was a bit disappointed in the process.

And the old me would have said, we;; you're a really bad mum and you should feel guilty about that, because he just asked you to do something that would have been a nurturing and connecting moment, but nah didn't have it in me, and therefore success for me was honouring that.

Fiona: 11:19

I love that, and the reality is he'll ask again, and at the next time he asks, you might be in, you know, you, can take the opportunity. And I think sometimes that can be a really key part when we think about success, we sometimes forget that opportunities will continue to come up.

Right, so if I don't do this now, if I don't make it now, if I don't hit the goal now, if I don't get there, I may never have the chance again.

And there are some things that come up that really are like that. And when we can understand what success means for us, we're more easily able to identify those opportunities that really are, I need to either go for it now, versus do you know what, there'll be another opportunity to have success in making muffins with Monty another time, or you know, because success right now is saying no.

Josephine: 12:25

Yeah, so, oh, totally, yeah. Yeah, I'm going to do it when it's a full-body yes and it honours me.

My energy, my pleasure, my connection with him, I'm not going to do it when it's going to lead to resentment and tiredness.

Fiona: 12:45

And I think that's one of the biggest reflections that we can start making around understanding what's authentic to us, is being able to ask that question, is this going to make me feel successful, or is this actually going to bring about that resentment piece, or is this going to lower my energy, or is this going to have the opposite effect of success?

Josephine: 13:13

Yeah, what does success feel like in your body, Fiona?

Fiona: 13:21

For me, I think it is really a sort of a relaxation. it's similar to you, it's not always a calmness, but it's certainly a relaxation, and a pride, there's a pride and a confidence that comes for me.

Josephine: 13:43

Yeah, like that.

Fiona: 13:45

It's a relaxed body.

Josephine: 13:49

I ask that because everybody’s going to be so different. And like I know a lot of people describe it to me as an excitement and a buzz and a fizz of yours cells or am aliveness or knowing in your bones that you're where you're supposed to be, or I don't know like your spine is lifted up.

Everyone is so different. For me, it's a calm and groundedness because that's the way I'm wired. But for other people, it's going to be really different.

Fiona: 14:20

And it might change from time to time as well, because I would say I probably had moments where there's been a fizz or an excitement and an upwards moving energy and there have been times where it is more of a relaxation or an outwards feeling energy that I'm going out and probably I've also had times where it has been a more grounding energy that's going downwards as well.

Josephine: 14:50

Yeah that’s a really good point, playing with it… what does success feel like for me?

Fiona: 15:00

I want to ask you what do you think is the opposite of success because I think one of the barriers to success is the sense of there is only success and failure.

So I want to ask you yeah what do you think is the opposite of success?

Josephine: 15:27

For me personally, it's a bitterness of having overdone it, or having given too much of myself and been left dry, jaded, burnt out at the extreme, because of the effort I've extended.

So, even if I get the good results, I've built a seven-figure business before, but that left me in burnout, that left me hardened, that left me shut down from all my needs, that left me to push away my emotions, just to cope with the structure of that business.

And this time in my business, I'm not doing it for anyone else. I'm not going to prove I'm a good clinician or that I can run a business like my dad and my grandfather did.

I'm just doing it what feels like joyful service for me to give to the world and we might end up at the same place but the process is going to be easeful this time and I'm following those little moments of what success feels like in my body the calm, the content, the relaxing of my cells it almost feels like and if I do feel that old bitterness come up which is the hardening the pushing people away the shutting people out so I can just do the work and the bitterness at those around me who aren't supporting me enough or the things that are going wrong you know I can start to feel their force and the strive which is

absolutely not a holistic success. Yes, there was success in business for a while, but it was at the expense of all the balance of my life relationships.

Oh Hobbies, I gave up so much for that one area of success and my body was telling me that all the time with the forcing and the hardening and the tension I was carrying, whereas now with the authentic success with every cell softening into this process, there is balance in my life that my loving relationship with my partner, my parenting, my friendships, my community, they all, the hobbies, they're they all benefit at the same time and it feels like balance and ease.

I hope that answers your question.

Fiona: 18:18

Yeah, I love that idea of that different areas of your life, where, as you say, you lost a lot of everything else to have success in one area, and that didn't feel authentic.

So being able to find success in multiple places, so valuable. Because I think we often think that it's just either I succeed or I fail.

And it's often not about a failure. It's about feeling. And it's about finding those areas and those small aspects of success and understanding what that shadow side might feel like.

but those feelings that were there don't necessarily mean that you fail. So you had that success and yet you also had some of those feelings that were there as well, but that didn't mean that you were failing.

You were actually building that really successful business. So it's not always as black and white as either I succeed or I fail.

I think that's where that authenticity piece fits.

Josephine: 19:44

Yep. Yep. Yeah, absolutely. And for me it's bitterness but for others it's frustration or anger. Everyone has that different go-to emotion when they know they're starting to force things that aren't natural.

Fiona: 20:03

So what do you think would be a first step if I wanted to really define or understand what success looked like.

If I wanted to change my definition of success, we've talked a little bit about feeling successful in our bodies and what that feels like.

What else is another, I guess, first step for me, or for someone listening who wanted to change their definition of success?

What are the things we need to think about, do you think?

Josephine: 20:41

I think awareness is always the part, so as you go through your day noticing when you feel like you've succeeded on completing something or stopping something, because a big part of that deep conditioning process for me is don’t have to complete anything, I can choose to stop before the goal is reached.

Ok I’ve just ate that. Does that feel good in my body or does that feel bad in my... body now. Or okay, I've just done this.

I've overdone it. Why? Just starting to build that bank of when it was a full body yes and you did it and you resulted in feeling like success in your body.

Or when it was a full body no, you did it anyway. it felt like the very opposite of success in your body.

That pain that can come as a result of that. And I even keep a record of this in my diary at times.

I, my decisions are based around the spleen and human design. So I call it a splenic, yes or a splenic no.

And I keep track of my splenic, uses my splenic nose in my body. And when I honoured them and the result of that.

So usually it's just went to the cafe because I got this little visual of I'd love to eat lunch at that cafe and I went and did it.

I didn’t keep working, I went to the cafe and I enjoyed it. And it's just tiny little things like that and over time tracking those wins for yourself is celebrating them and then they start to build and to success in your life.

Fiona: 22:29

I love that writing it down so that you can recognise those feelings. So I love when you say, you know, whether it was a full body yes and I did it, noticing that if it was a full body no, but I did it anyway, you might even write down if it's not a full body yes or a full body no, if you're not sure and you go, I think maybe it's a yes.

So I'm going do it and that's going help you to understand what a full body yes or a full body no means for you because I can imagine that there will be people and I've been in this situation before where I haven't really known what that full yes or that full no means there's a little bit of this maybe maybe not feeling so I love the idea of yeah writing the down what's going on in your body what sensations are you feeling are you feeling buzzy are you feeling relaxed are you feeling tension are you feeling that you are clenching or closing or do you feel like you're opening and then what the result of whatever it is you do what happens after and then comparing the two to love that.

Josephine: 23:47

Perfect summary as always thank you Fiona and I mentioned Human Design before so just to elaborate on that I realize I should give some context human design is an incredible tool and if you're looking for a hint at what your full body yes or no feels like based on your spiritual blueprint. It's based on the time and the date you're born. Then I recommend, we'll put a note in the show notes of where to go get a chat so that you can start looking into what's called your authority, and that can start to give you a hint as to what natural success should feel like in your body, your unique body, because it might be very different to mine or the Fiona’s as we've described today.

Fiona: 24:32

Yeah, understanding what that is, and I think what you're fine is when you know what that is, you go, yeah, that's how I've always understood whether I'm yes or no, and whether I'm into it.

I've had a couple of people ask me before I tend to be in my decision-making comes from my sacral, so my tummy and my gut feeling, it's that gut sense, and I've generally, if I'm unsure about a decision.

Deep down I know I'm just talking through it and I've had a couple of people at different times just ask me, do you want to do this? and it can be scary to kind of go or uh-huh but it comes from that place that just knowing but I haven't always wanted to admit or to say that that's what I feel like because of the fear of what will come after that point. The fear of success or the fear of you know what might happen, so I think that's another point to sort of think about is to understand what that is for you, and generally you'll find yeah that you you know yeah that that is often how I've I kind of know it'll make sense

Josephine: 26:04

Yeah, and you're so right Fiona in that success is terrifying Like if I was being really truthful and said my ideas of what success will be to me over the next 10 years.

I'd be scared of judgement. You know like I want the piece of land where we get to regenerate native bush in the house and it feels like I've got many desires But all you've got to do is start with this yes and no like, this feels right yes this feels wrong no. and then sometimes it just feels like a not yet. And then you just wait wait for that yes, no full body feeling to come in.

Fiona: 26:43

Hmm Yeah, and I think being able to ask yourself, is it Am I fearing success here?

Is that why I'm saying no and That can again give you a little bit of a hint to whether actually this is this you know what authentic success feels like for you.

Because inauthentic success is that external driver, isn't it? We've talked about that. It is the feeling that I am getting this success because I've been taught that this is what success means, so I'm going to go for it.

But when it's actually our authentic success and it really means something to us, that's where the emotions come into play.

And that's where the fear can then come into play because it's so meaningful. And that's when it is success that is not authentic, you will have less of that fear than when it is something that really is connected to you.

So if you are feeling fear around success, follow that breadcrumb, follow that feeling, ask yourself what is that's going on with that feeling because you are on the right track to finding your successful, your authentic success when that fear shows up.

Josephine: 28:16

Thank you for bringing that up Fiona. Because we are doing so much when you start to say hang on a minute, who's expectation is this?

Oh it's my mum's or my dad's. It feels like we're literally breaking that relationship. We feel like that little child inside that saying, I don't love you anymore mum and dad.

But we have to go through that. have to let the expectations go to be able to take on our own.

And then you have to step into your new version of success and be seen doing that. And there's just layers of emotions that can come up with that.

I still get anxiety when I choose to go slow in my day. As if should be the little duck with my legs, you know, pumping under the water at all times.

I can't just float and enjoy my day, even though the results are the same. Well, probably even better if I enjoy it and relax into my day, then if I was the little duck with my legs pumping under the water the whole time.

But yet, success is scary. It does. It is anxiety provoking. Yeah. Amazing point Fiona.

Fiona: 29:32

So if we go back to what we sort of talked a little bit about towards the beginning of this episode was that success doesn't always need to be in those big things.

So to help you overcome those feelings of fear, because it is something that's going to bring up all sorts of emotions for you.

Start small, start by taking that reflection, that time to reflect around what success feels like, starting to build that bank of small pieces of success.

So turning the laptop off before you've finished before your, you know, you might have pushed through, but you want to take that time, it might be something much smaller than success in life.

It might just be success in your day to day. Feel what that feels like, and that's going to help you build and work through that fear as you work towards something bigger.

We're going to pop up on the Instagram grid over on our Act Outside the Square podcast Instagram page, a post that says success and we'd love for you to come across and share your little successes, your big successes and what other ways you feel success in your body.

Josephine: 31:11

Thanks Fiona and we appreciate you, every one of you who listens and reaches out to share your experience with us.

It brings us so much joy to see the community we're building here. So yeah, feel free to connect with us at any time that you like and outside the Squeeze podcast on Instagram.

Fiona: 31:34

So until next week, enjoy feeling your successes.

Josephine: 31:41

Bye for now.

Josephine: 31:43

Before we finish up for today, we would like to acknowledge the original custodians of the lands on which our podcast is created, the Ngāi Tahu people of Aotearoa New Zealand,

Fiona: 31:52

and the Cammeraygal people of the Eora Nation Australia. We pay our respects to elders past, present and emerging and to all our listeners who identify as Aboriginal, Torres Straight Islander, or Maori.

Josephine: 32:05

We love connecting with you, our listeners and talking about the topics that mean the most to you. Reach out to us on Instagram at Outside the Square Podcast and let us know what you want to hear more of.

Fiona: 32:16

Until next week, keep stepping outside your square.